Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

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Stuart
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Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by Stuart »

Hi all,

I normally use Humbrol Enamel Thinners with my Enamel paints but I've run out - I do however have a bottle of white spirit.

Do Humbrol Enamels thin OK with WS? I've heard that Humbrol's thinners are basically white spirit anyway.

Cheers!
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by celt »

Hi Sir T,Humbrol enamels thin just as well with white spirits.When I was using them, I never used their thinner and had no problems.
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by Stuart »

celt wrote:Hi Sir T,Humbrol enamels thin just as well with white spirits.When I was using them, I never used their thinner and had no problems.
Thanks Celt - That's just I wanted to know before I knackard some of my paint!
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by celt »

No probs,I just wish I could still use them. :sad: They were the best paint I have used.These acrylics are diving me up the wall. :evil:
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by Zee28 »

Hi Stuart,

Yes mate, certainly. Humbrol enamels can be thinned with white spirit (or cellulose nitrate automotive thinner). And the great thing is that both of these products are available in big quantities (4 or 5 litre containers) incredibly cheaply, white spirit from DIY stores such as Wickes (£7.99 for 4 litres) and cellulose from automotive paint suppliers (around £10 for 5 litres).

These quantities will last a long time for general modelling due to the large quantities and make for very cheap thinner and economical model panting. There is absolutely no need to buy proprietary thinners which are only available is small quantities but are also much, much more costly in a litre for litre comparison.

I have used Humbrol enamels with the above two thinning agents on every model I have ever built with no problems (with some minor exceptions detailed below) and also use cellulose nitrate automotive thinner to clean the airbrush in just a few minutes. Bubble it, blow it through, job done. Celly dissolves and cleans anything!

My only words of caution are:

1) Cellulose nitrate automotive thinner is pretty vicious stuff and must be handled carefully, it can dissolve most plastics, so handle it modestly and use with caution. Plus, it stinks and makes you cough, yuk! Far easier with white spirit!

2) 99% of Humbrol enamels respond very well with white spirit as a thinner but there are one or two exceptions, as follows:

a) Humbrol 65 (aircraft Blue) can be uncooperative with white spirit and has a tendency to go powdery, cellulose is better for this particular colour, don't know why, it's just this one colour, but it airbrushes much better with cellulose.

b) All Humbol clear colours (such as Clear Red Hu 1321, Clear Orange Hu 1322 and Clear Green Hu 1325) will NOT thin with white spirit, in fact they will thicken and go lumpy, cellulose has to used with these clear colours, but only these three. I often use these for tinting canopies like the top of this old Sea King canopy....


Image

Please accept that I do NOT for one moment profess to be a paint chemical expert or anything like that, but I have ben spraying real (1/1 scale) cars as part of my classic car hobby for over 25 years and have gained some experience of paint handling.


celt wrote:These acrylics are diving me up the wall. :evil:
Hi Celt. Sorry mate, but this is what acrylic paints are designed to do! :evil: It's their main job......


Zee28
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by ShaunW »

Since the dawn of time (well, the 1970's at any rate!) I've only ever used DIY store white spirit to thin enamel paints, Stuart, not only Humbrol but also Revell enamels.
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by Stuart »

celt wrote:No probs,I just wish I could still use them. :sad: They were the best paint I have used.These acrylics are diving me up the wall. :evil:
Yeah I agree, I'm fed up of the things as well. I've been having some issues with Humbrol's acrylics recently that gave nearly caused me to bin a couple of builds. I am trying out other brands (Hataka, Tamiya and Revell) but I just fancy a break - So I'm going to do some enamel painting in my car at lunch.
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by Stuart »

ShaunW wrote:Since the dawn of time (well, the 1970's at any rate!) I've only ever used DIY store white spirit to thin enamel paints, Stuart, not only Humbrol but also Revell enamels.
Thanks Shaun!
Stuart Templeton I may not be good but I'm slow...

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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by Stuart »

Zee28 wrote:Hi Stuart,

Yes mate, certainly. Humbrol enamels can be thinned with white spirit (or cellulose nitrate automotive thinner). And the great thing is that both of these products are available in big quantities (4 or 5 litre containers) incredibly cheaply, white spirit from DIY stores such as Wickes (£7.99 for 4 litres) and cellulose from automotive paint suppliers (around £10 for 5 litres).

These quantities will last a long time for general modelling due to the large quantities and make for very cheap thinner and economical model panting. There is absolutely no need to buy proprietary thinners which are only available is small quantities but are also much, much more costly in a litre for litre comparison.

I have used Humbrol enamels with the above two thinning agents on every model I have ever built with no problems (with some minor exceptions detailed below) and also use cellulose nitrate automotive thinner to clean the airbrush in just a few minutes. Bubble it, blow it through, job done. Celly dissolves and cleans anything!

My only words of caution are:

1) Cellulose nitrate automotive thinner is pretty vicious stuff and must be handled carefully, it can dissolve most plastics, so handle it modestly and use with caution. Plus, it stinks and makes you cough, yuk! Far easier with white spirit!

2) 99% of Humbrol enamels respond very well with white spirit as a thinner but there are one or two exceptions, as follows:

a) Humbrol 65 (aircraft Blue) can be uncooperative with white spirit and has a tendency to go powdery, cellulose is better for this particular colour, don't know why, it's just this one colour, but it airbrushes much better with cellulose.

b) All Humbol clear colours (such as Clear Red Hu 1321, Clear Orange Hu 1322 and Clear Green Hu 1325) will NOT thin with white spirit, in fact they will thicken and go lumpy, cellulose has to used with these clear colours, but only these three. I often use these for tinting canopies like the top of this old Sea King canopy....


Image

Please accept that I do NOT for one moment profess to be a paint chemical expert or anything like that, but I have ben spraying real (1/1 scale) cars as part of my classic car hobby for over 25 years and have gained some experience of paint handling.


celt wrote:These acrylics are diving me up the wall. :evil:
Hi Celt. Sorry mate, but this is what acrylic paints are designed to do! :evil: It's their main job......


Zee28
That's great info Mr Zee - Ta very much, I shall print your comment and stick it with my paint chart.

I didn't even realise they did those 'clear colours' :shock:



So I assume then that WS is good to use with Humbrol's enamel Clear Coats?
Stuart Templeton I may not be good but I'm slow...

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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by ShaunW »

I only use WS to thin the enamely clear coats as well, Stuart. The main issue with WS is it adds to the smell. In fact, I think it makes up for 90% of the smell when airbrushing enamels :roll:

With acrylics I tend to largely use Tamiya and I do use their X-20A thinners. For a number of years I thinned Tamiya paints with Halfords economy screen wash, which was blue in colour and worked a treat. Much cheapness too. Halfords then changed the screen wash formula and I haven't tried it yet although I intend to buy a small bottle and give it a go - if it doesn't work the remainder will go into the car screen washer bottles as intended by the manufacturer :grin: I tend not to brush paint anything beyond detail work these days but if I did, I would stick to enamels. How anyone manages to brush paint large areas with acrylics is beyond me, I just can't make the damned things work other than through an airbrush!
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by Stuart »

ShaunW wrote:I only use WS to thin the enamely clear coats as well, Stuart. The main issue with WS is it adds to the smell. In fact, I think it makes up for 90% of the smell when airbrushing enamels :roll:

With acrylics I tend to largely use Tamiya and I do use their X-20A thinners. For a number of years I thinned Tamiya paints with Halfords economy screen wash, which was blue in colour and worked a treat. Much cheapness too. Halfords then changed the screen wash formula and I haven't tried it yet although I intend to buy a small bottle and give it a go - if it doesn't work the remainder will go into the car screen washer bottles as intended by the manufacturer :grin: I tend not to brush paint anything beyond detail work these days but if I did, I would stick to enamels. How anyone manages to brush paint large areas with acrylics is beyond me, I just can't make the damned things work other than through an airbrush!
Thanks Shaun! I think you're right in regards to the smell - The actual paints aren't bad, but what my wife objects to is the brush cleaning etc.

As for painting large areas in Acylics... It can be done but it's such a PITA I need a break for a while - My next few builds will all be enamel.

Cheers!

ST
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by iggie »

I must admit that I only ever used white spirit when I used enamel paints years ago; it was readily available from Dad's garage and it worked well with the old Airfix glass bottle range of paints :-D

I carried on using it with the new fangled tinlets when they became more common, and then again on my return to the hobby ten years or so ago.

I now use acrylic only, and due to being lazy mainly with the hairy stick; Tamiya thinners get used in all makes that I use (Humbrol, Revell, Xtracrylix, Lifecolour & AK Interactive) and I even have a bottle of their flow enhancer which does seem to lengthen the working time of acrylics somewhat.
Best wishes

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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by Stuart »

iggie wrote:I must admit that I only ever used white spirit when I used enamel paints years ago; it was readily available from Dad's garage and it worked well with the old Airfix glass bottle range of paints :-D

I carried on using it with the new fangled tinlets when they became more common, and then again on my return to the hobby ten years or so ago.

I now use acrylic only, and due to being lazy mainly with the hairy stick; Tamiya thinners get used in all makes that I use (Humbrol, Revell, Xtracrylix, Lifecolour & AK Interactive) and I even have a bottle of their flow enhancer which does seem to lengthen the working time of acrylics somewhat.
iggie how do you get on using Tamiya on small parts?

I've found it ok on large areas that are primed, but have had no luck with it on small parts or cockpits - It just flakes off.
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by iggie »

Sir T wrote:
iggie wrote:I must admit that I only ever used white spirit when I used enamel paints years ago; it was readily available from Dad's garage and it worked well with the old Airfix glass bottle range of paints :-D

I carried on using it with the new fangled tinlets when they became more common, and then again on my return to the hobby ten years or so ago.

I now use acrylic only, and due to being lazy mainly with the hairy stick; Tamiya thinners get used in all makes that I use (Humbrol, Revell, Xtracrylix, Lifecolour & AK Interactive) and I even have a bottle of their flow enhancer which does seem to lengthen the working time of acrylics somewhat.
iggie how do you get on using Tamiya on small parts?

I've found it ok on large areas that are primed, but have had no luck with it on small parts or cockpits - It just flakes off.
I can't say that I've noticed a problem (and I rarely prime anything! :shock: ) with Tamiya on small parts, but in fairness I'd tend to use Humbrol or Revell for that kind of work 8-)
Best wishes

Jim
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Re: Humbrol Enamels and white spirit

Post by Chuck E »

celt wrote:No probs,I just wish I could still use them. :sad: They were the best paint I have used.These acrylics are diving me up the wall. :evil:
I find that the new Acrylic, in the screw top jar, are pretty good, Thinning is the secret. Don't forget a nice coat of grey Halfords Primer first.

The acrylic rattle cans are also very good. Two coats of carefully thinned Acrylic will hand brush very nicely, but don't try to get a full cover with the first coat. It won't happen.

I use Humbrol Colours a lot. The enamels are not always as good as the old ones used to be, however, and Humbrol should maybe pay more attention to testing, both by their own Quality Control Department and Road Tests with modellers.

There are so many manufacturers out there, that you can build up a nice selection, geared to your own preference, so just do that.

If I was Mr Humbrol, I would want to produce a range of paints that would be the One Stop Shop for all modellers. This is not Pie in the Sky, it is an achievable target. Humbrol have a very well known brand name, and once upon a time, I never thought of using any other product. Things started to go awry after the devastating and tragic fire. They have not yet fully recovered and have left the door open for a whole range of others to jump in. They can still take back top billing.. If they make it, we will continue to buy.

I was under the impression, that all enamels were to be phased out, to be replaced with acrylics across the board. This seems to have gone away. I thought that it was a health and environmental thing.
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