figures and disturbing implications

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rob_van_riel
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figures and disturbing implications

Post by rob_van_riel »

I spent some time today at an event looking (mostly) at figures. This hammered home some tendencies I'd noticed earlier, which quite honestly I find a bit disturbing.

First, the appearent obsession with the SS. Why isn't it good enough to produce figures of WWII German soldiers, and is about half of them (guestimate, possibly very biased) focussed on SS subjects, especially since the only real visible difference between SS and Wehrmacht is found in a few minor insignia. I don't share modern Germany's desire to deny the existence of hard core nazis and their symbols, but I do feel they're over-represented.

Second, women. I get that they were until recently a very minor part of military operations, and are thus scarce in that domain, but there are other domains. Why is it that a ridiculous percentage of those shown outside the military domain are barely short of pornographic, even when their male counterparts are not? Are we really such a sleazy bunch? Worse, are we such a sleazy bunch that in general we're rather uninterested in female figures that are appropriately dressed and kitted out for the apparent occasion (all too often, combat or other forms of violent confrontation)?

Am I the only one getting occasionally riled up by this? Or am I just seeing things that aren't there?
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splash
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by splash »

I have to agree with you they are subjects that seem to get over represented, I used to have an LMS that also stocked 1/6 scale doll like figures and the majority tended to be high ranking German officers or SS figures.
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Zee28
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by Zee28 »

I agree Rob, especially on the scantily clad and, erm, 'over-developed' figure models of women. And it does make us a modellers look a bit seedy.

But it's only figure modellers, thankfully. I'll stick with planes......

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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by rob_van_riel »

Zee28 wrote:I agree Rob, especially on the scantily glad and, erm, 'over-developed' figure models of women. And it does make us a modellers look a bit seedy.
I suspect it also plays a part in keeping the real thing out of the hobby. Karmic justice in the case of the pervs, I guess, but not so fair to the rest of us and the ladies.
But it's only figure modellers, thankfully. I'll stick with planes......
Sadly, that excuse doesn't work for me :cry:
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Eric Mc
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by Eric Mc »

I wonder what all those who painted risque artwork on the noses of B-17s and B-24s were thinking?
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iggie
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by iggie »

Whilst I don't do any figure work, I do agree that the availability of female subjects seems to be swayed heavily towards a focus on sexuality over any other consideration.
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by rob_van_riel »

Eric Mc wrote:I wonder what all those who painted risque artwork on the noses of B-17s and B-24s were thinking?
"I wish I could get a grope of the real thing", probably :twisted:

Seriously though, painting risque nose art on airplanes at the front line during war is a vastly different world from scale modelling.
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by rob_van_riel »

iggie wrote:Whilst I don't do any figure work, I do agree that the availability of female subjects seems to be swayed heavily towards a focus on sexuality over any other consideration.
It's beginning to sound like I'm not just seeing things, so the question then becomes, why? Personally, I'm put of by this. I just can't take the figure seriously in these cases. When I do find an appropriately dressed female figure, I'll typically snap it up, but the "little or no clothes, thus little or no common sense" swarm gets ignored. Does this mark me as wierd?
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by JamesPerrin »

I think Andrea (?) do some female military personel mostly Russian, that I wouldn't be embarrassed showing my wife. They also do some I would
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by iggie »

JamesPerrin wrote:I think Andrea (?) do some female military personel mostly Russian, that I wouldn't be embarrassed showing my wife. They also do some I would
And I wonder what the proportion would be from the opposite side; how many male figures are out there that a female modeller would be embarrassed to show her husband? Very few I suspect......

I think Rob has raised a very real and worrying point here; it seems that either modellers only want to build and paint female figures with a sexual aspect or manufacturers think that is all modellers would want to buy.... or both could be true? Either way I'm not happy about it......
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by Chuck E »

An Ex Serviceman at one of our shows asked why there were so many German subjects. "After all, we won."

I answered that, in my case, I wanted to show our adversaries, usually aircraft, or ships, but felt that a lot of modellers were attracted by the more colourful / dramatic German schemes. Quite a few showed wrecked German armour, too. The Insignia / Uniform displays quite often have a few German items.

I have been displaying a Battle of Britain set, and wanted to show aircraft from both sides of the conflict.

As for the ladies. I actually found that women visiting the shows, found them a welcome change from the acres of heavy metal. A lot of the figures are pure fantasy, anyway, and have often been taken from films and comic books. I can only remember once when we had to ask for a model to be removed from the display, and only once where some of the Japanese figures had to be sold Under The Counter, due to them being thought a little bit risque. To be honest, nothing much more appears on our tables than figures often seen on TV, Films and in Mags, comics and tabloids. We just need to keep our eyes and minds open. If we see something a little too naughty, we can have it removed.
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by rob_van_riel »

iggie wrote:And I wonder what the proportion would be from the opposite side; how many male figures are out there that a female modeller would be embarrassed to show her husband? Very few I suspect......
I don't know, really. I suppose that for some it would get really disturbing if the missus spent all her time fondling and drooling over muscle bound barbarians. There a bit of double standard going on here; near nudity and exaggerated breasts are sleazy, near nudity and exaggerated muscles aren't.
iggie wrote:I think Rob has raised a very real and worrying point here; it seems that either modellers only want to build and paint female figures with a sexual aspect or manufacturers think that is all modellers would want to buy.... or both could be true? Either way I'm not happy about it......
I suppose the only thing we can do about this, is vote with our wallets: buy the sensible female figures, and leave the soft porn on the shelves.

I realise this may not help much, given that figure builders are amost a separate culture, but we should do what we can.
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by rob_van_riel »

Chuck E wrote:An Ex Serviceman at one of our shows asked why there were so many German subjects. "After all, we won."

I answered that, in my case, I wanted to show our adversaries, usually aircraft, or ships, but felt that a lot of modellers were attracted by the more colourful / dramatic German schemes. Quite a few showed wrecked German armour, too. The Insignia / Uniform displays quite often have a few German items.
There a bit of technology freak in most of us, and the Germans did have some of the more interesting hardware. I understand that, and appreciate that the SS had disproportionate access to the more exotic stuff. Logically then, those machines would be in their markings, as would any crew. No problem there. It's the figures that are clearly not intended to go with machinery that have me worried.
To be honest, nothing much more appears on our tables than figures often seen on TV, Films and in Mags, comics and tabloids. We just need to keep our eyes and minds open.
Context is everything here. I've got a "Lady Godiva" hiding in the stash somewhere, and if I ever get around to building her, she won't be wearing more than her long hair, as per the legend. The scandal was the point of the whole affair. Ditto for comic and movie stuff, we shouldn't need to make our models different from the original. I have similar issues with excessive sexualisation in that domain, but that's another discussion.
None of this excuses the 'original' pure fantasy though, and if pure fantasy requires all women to be half naked, I'm worried.
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by VMA131Marine »

Eric Mc wrote:I wonder what all those who painted risque artwork on the noses of B-17s and B-24s were thinking?
Probably whether they would survive the next mission. Different time, different circumstances.
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Re: figures and disturbing implications

Post by VMA131Marine »

rob_van_riel wrote:
Eric Mc wrote:I wonder what all those who painted risque artwork on the noses of B-17s and B-24s were thinking?
"I wish I could get a grope of the real thing", probably :twisted:

Seriously though, painting risque nose art on airplanes at the front line during war is a vastly different world from scale modelling.
With women combat pilots now serving in the US armed forces, that thinking probably would not fly today (no pun intended).
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