selling off built models

[rob_van_riel]

The apparent collapse of the 'auctioning off the results' part of the Jimmy Build(*) got me thinking about alternative ways to sell off the resulting models, and from there to selling off models in general. There's an LHS here that has some built stuff for sale, but they appear somewhat overstocked in this department, and of course there's greedy old Evilbay, but other than that, I can't really think of anything. Travelling far and wide in hopes of finding a buyer is not on the agenda as far as I'm concerned. Does anyone here know of an on-line marketplace (other than eBay) where one has a decent change of finding potential buyers?


(*) correct me if I'm wrong about this, but two months of zero detectable activity of any kind by the organiser has brought me to the point where I believe this project to be dead.

[mattbacon]

Not sure about "greedy" or evil, but I'm staggered by some of the prices my recently auctioned built ups fetched on eBay. Considering it was a punt, rather than giving em to charity shops who wouldn't know what to do with them or kids who would break off the fragile bits and fly them round the room, then the "reach" of eBay now seems well worth paying for! Sure, I've not made a profit if you take into account cost of kit plus craftsman's hourly rate to build it, but if you assume that a good part of the value to ME of a model is the challenge and relaxation of building it, rather than the sitting on a shelf looking at it then it seems that it might as well be in the hands of someone who DOES value it as a shelf ornament. And that value seems to be quite high -- the biggest surprise was over £100 for a 1/48 Chipmunk! I'd want to get a lot more per hour for a commission build, since the build would be work rather than relaxation, but given that this is about making the best of enforced shelf clearance (and stash reduction) it seems surprisingly lucrative. My posh paint booth for the new modelling den is fully funded! I think if you turn up your nose at eBay for this, you'll be cutting it off to spite your face!

Bestest,
M.

[DazDaMan]

Many moons ago, I sold off some models that I had built at a car boot sale. No idea who bought them, but they were going for £3 a piece. I sold ten!

[rob_van_riel]

Not sure about "greedy" or evil

To my mind, taking a 10% cut of everything without providing any kind of support qualifies. Never said they weren't effective though..

Just out of curiosity, on which particular eBay did you list them? There are some differences between listing on UK or US, including the fact that their search engine sometimes gets confused.

[mattbacon]

I sold them on eBay UK, with postage to Europe, which means they show up on their European sites. And I think the 10% is basically what you pay because there AREN'T any other "on-line marketplaces where one has a decent change of finding potential buyers?". I'd rather have 90% of something that sells, and sells for a larger price because it reaches far more potential buyers, than 100% of nothing...

bestest,
M.

[rob_van_riel]

I sold them on eBay UK, with postage to Europe, which means they show up on their European sites.

Thanks. I'll keep it in mind as an option.

And I think the 10% is basically what you pay because there AREN'T any other "on-line marketplaces where one has a decent change of finding potential buyers?".

This is why societies tend to put rather ugly restrains on monopolists; their ability to get away with outragious behaviour if unrestrained is just too great. It is also the reason I'm so eager to find an alternative; I despise profiteering. eBay is getting fairly close to the point where I'll prefer to send stuff to the landfill rather than pay them to sell it. Things might be different if were desperate for the money, but I'm not.

[mattbacon]

I'm intrigued by how passionate you are about this, Rob! Rather send your models to landfill than let eBay have some of the money you make from them? What do you think would be a "reasonable" fee structure for building a global infrastructure that allows people to sell things securely to other people all around the world? I worked in a second hand music and video shop, where the standard system was to give the seller 1/3 of the new price and sell for 2/3. Apple takes 30% of the App Store sales price, and yet according to the annual Developer Economics" survey is far and away the best marketplace for developers. It's not a case of evil monopolists, IMHO, it's because the offer to the user is best...

Bestest,
M.

[rob_van_riel]

I'm intrigued by how passionate you are.... to the user is best...

There are several parts to this.

First is that, given my opinion of eBay, I prefer to support them as little as possible. Given that I don't need the money I might get for the kits, and that having them on display with some stranger I've never met is a marginal bonus at best, dumping the models is a small price to pay. Ethics have a price, and I'm fortunate to able to afford them in this case.

Second (and more complicated) are the reasons I don't like eBay. This is a matter of balance. On the one hand, I fully appreciate just what a technical marvel they've built, and the incredible possibilities this has opened up for so many people, myself included. Those that built and maintain it have every right to be paid handsomely for their efforts, and those that drove the development may well deserve to have gotten filthy rich in the process. Given that they ran a three billion dollar profit in 2013, I'd say they've accomplished that with considerable room to spare. Now, if there were any kind of serious competition, I'd say more power to them, but there isn't. For a monopolist, some modesty is in order to avoid generating resentment, but clearly, greed has taken over instead, as the cut they take is forever going up. Most provocative in my case is what they've been doing with shipping. I don't mind paying a percentage of the sale value, but having to pay eBay a percentage of the shipping cost as well seems ridiculous. On top of that, they push really hard to make sellers use the most expensive shipping they can come up with, driving total prices (and their share) up. Ebay and the mail services profit, sellers and buyers lose out. I expect this will only get worse unless some form of competition shows up. On top of that, information about the way they work is all but non-existent (tried in vain to find the fee structure yesterday), and customer service has gone from minimal to none at all. In short, users pay more every year, and get less in return every year.

[iggie]

Just a thought on the shipping percentage going to ebay; in recent times (last couple of years) there has been a noticeable (to me anyway) increase in items being sold for very low buy it now prices with ridiculously high postal charges. Why? Because until now, postage was not included in seller fee calculations.
So perhaps (although I do agree with the principal of your argument Rob) it could be that the 'savvy' sellers have brought this on themselves, and as usual, spoilt things for the majority.

[rob_van_riel]

Just a thought on the shipping... the 'savvy' sellers have brought this on themselves, and as usual, spoilt things for the majority.

This probably has something to do with it, although it was always against the T&Cs to pad the shipping costs. Clearly, it's easier for eBay to just grab more of everyone's money than to actually enforce their own rules. Still, having been on the receiving end of of this kind of collective punishment rather too often, it ticks me off immensely.
Maybe I should start ripping off organisations as well; if I'm to be punished fo it, I might as well enjoy some of the benefits too before the hammer falls

[jamesaw]

And don't forget the wholly owned subsidiary Paypal. Also, the latest ebay ploy on the US site is prepaid customs which is positioned as a convenience to buyers. If you are shipping via post and the value is under $40, into Canada at least-no duties are charged regardless of point of origin. If you do have to pay duty, it is at the HST rate of 13% in Ontario plus $5 to Canada Post to collect it, still a much cheaper proposition than paying the $11 or $12 fee for the clearance plus the duty offered by ebay. I will not do business with anyone who uses the ebay internal International Shipping option not because they are bad sellers, but because the rates charged by ebay are exorbitant and in many cases totally unnecessary.

[mattbacon]

It depends on where you're shipping to. It's a different picture when you're paying 20% on the total including packing and shipping plus £8 to the Post Office for a "handling charge"....

Bestest,
M.

[rob_van_riel]

It depends on where you're shipping to. It's a different picture when you're paying 20% on the total including packing and shipping plus £8 to the Post Office for a "handling charge"....

True, but eBay knows this, and adjusts the costs based on destination. The numbers you quote are roughly equal to what one would have to pay here in The Netherlands, and their price is increased accordingly to a point where it is once again a rip off. I'm with jamesaw on this; any seller insisting on using their shipping program is most likely disqualified (the exception being items where the total price works out to a good number, but for that to be true the item would have to sell far below a reasonable price. Their loss...)

[mattbacon]

i've not tried it on eBay. It's certainly worth it for me using the equivalent when buying from Amazon.Com...

bestest,
m.

[AndrewR]

And don't forget the wholly owned subsidiary Paypal. Also, the latest ebay ploy on the US site is prepaid customs which is positioned as a convenience to buyers. If you are shipping via post and the value is under $40, into Canada at least-no duties are charged regardless of point of origin. If you do have to pay duty, it is at the HST rate of 13% in Ontario plus $5 to Canada Post to collect it, still a much cheaper proposition than paying the $11 or $12 fee for the clearance plus the duty offered by ebay. I will not do business with anyone who uses the ebay internal International Shipping option not because they are bad sellers, but because the rates charged by ebay are exorbitant and in many cases totally unnecessary.

Totally agree with you James. I automatically ignore anything in that International Shippers Program.

Especially because you can't combine orders. This is to "prevent complications".

Total rip off for Canadian customers trying to shop in the US. Thanks EBay. Great move