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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 12:10 pm 
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I'm in. Of course, rockets take off vertically too and if they land at all that's usually vertical too :grin:

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 1:50 pm 
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I'll keep in!, might try something other than a Harrier though!!. :grin:

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 6:02 pm 
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Dazzled wrote:
I'm in. Of course, rockets take off vertically too and if they land at all that's usually vertical too :grin:


That's a thought...... :grin:

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 7:11 pm 
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Why is he so confused ?
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Well then, we could include autogiros capable of being jump-started ...

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 8:01 pm 
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Haha well yes they do!
Could we count rockets?
I think we need to change the name again to the "Up and Down GB" haha!

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 8:30 pm 
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Not many rockets I know of do a VL. The SpaceX Falcon does. Does the Jeff Bezos one?

Not sure about autogyros. Aren't they more STOL?

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 8:38 pm 
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I thought rockets all do basically a controlled crash with a id if parachutes?

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 9:01 pm 
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Yep.....
But it's still a vertical landing :-D

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 9:38 pm 
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jRatz wrote:
Well then, we could include autogiros capable of being jump-started ...
dwomby wrote:
...Not sure about autogyros. Aren't they more STOL?...
Autogyros are STOL and some of them not even that. They need the forward motion provided by [usually] a pusher prop or jet to get the main rotor turning to provide lift. Queens University used to have some they used at Newtownards Airport. Most of them took longer to take off and get to 50 feet than the Cessna 172 types took to get to 100 feet.

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 10:27 pm 
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Why is he so confused ?
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fredk wrote:
jRatz wrote:
Well then, we could include autogiros capable of being jump-started ...
dwomby wrote:
...Not sure about autogyros. Aren't they more STOL?...
Autogyros are STOL and some of them not even that. They need the forward motion provided by [usually] a pusher prop or jet to get the main rotor turning to provide lift. Queens University used to have some they used at Newtownards Airport. Most of them took longer to take off and get to 50 feet than the Cessna 172 types took to get to 100 feet.


No, some autogiros ( two that I am aware of are the Ciera and Kellet ) have secondary flight controls -- a rotor transmission clutch (aka pre-rotator) which, when engaged, starts the rotor spinning before takeoff, and a collective to reduce blade pitch beforehand. The trick, and it is a trick, is to overdrive the rotor and basically pop it off off the ground, disengage the clutch, and let the engine pull it forward, back in normal autogiro mode.

Here is an old film on youtube showing a Ciera: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ly261Dt1Of8
There are a few other, new autogiros, that do this also - google "autogiro jump takeoff"

And here, from my museum, is a still sequence showing Dave Driscoll jumping a Kellet XO-60
Image

Image

Image

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 26th, 2017, 11:00 pm 
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Then strictly its not an AUTO-Gyro
The very name indicates that the rotor is self turning and not powered.

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 27th, 2017, 10:42 am 
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Fred, such a machine would still fly unpowered, the powered rotor is just meant to shorten the take off run.

David.

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 27th, 2017, 9:40 pm 
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Ooooook so just to confirm who is ok with Jan to Feb?

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 28th, 2017, 1:59 am 
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For me, with the other GBs running in January - February - early March I'd prefer it later; Mid-March into April
But I shall probably just try to fit it in when ever it is

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 Post subject: Re: VTOL Group Build?
PostPosted: November 28th, 2017, 2:27 am 
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Why is he so confused ?
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Unsure.
It depends on my progress with an off-line conversion project.

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